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[Poll]
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Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemployment?
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| Take the new job |
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| Keep the old job |
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| Take both & go insane |
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| Quit working & live off of the State |
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Total Votes : 6
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(last vote on : 2/5/2010 5:12:46 PM)
(Poll ended: 2/5/2010 5:00:00 PM)
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Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemployment? - 2/2/2010 9:51:15 PM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 1948
Status: offline
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Want to make sure that I note that I am not whining.
I am trying to be factual about my current job, so I can get across my dilemma. I am very grateful for it, and what it has allowed me to do.
I have been with my company for five years. In my industry that's a nice stretch.
I have also made some enemies. I am not good at politicking. I tend to just tell as it is. 
I have received raises of 2% to 5% and bonuses of nothing to 2% to 5%, and educational benefits.
Over the years several compensatory promises have been broken, and swept under the rug.
My current boss would throw me under the bus if it made him look good for 2 seconds. He is also extremely lazy and inept. Most of the work he does (other than surfing the net) is from copy/paste from books. He has no qualm taking credit for work done by others, without acknowledging who actually did the heavy lifting. He has been my boss twice, as the manager between us quit. It supposed to isolate him from all the heavy work, but after 1.5 years my managers said forget it - but in a very inappropriate way  .
The chief (my boss's boss) is new, as the old chief was fired as he politicked too much, yet could not deliver anything viable.
The new chief is an unknown entity.
I spend about 5% to 8% of my gross income on fuel just for commute. It is exhausting to be in the car for so many hours each day.
I have had five direct management changes already, and expect an other one soon.
I like the current direction of my responsibilities.
My current job also allows me to work from home twice a week, and the office hours are very relaxed. Come late, leave early. Of course, I am on call 24/7, so I consider that a trade-off.
If I take college courses, or similar education classes, after approval, most of it is reimbursed.
I am relatively stable, as my expertise is rare, and am reliable. Some call me a "machine", and joke they could set their clock, how I deliver. But, no one is indispensable in todays economy.
- - -
I am asked to interview and consider an other position, that is although in my general knowhow, and could do it without a problem, it is not the primary direction I want to go.
It would reduce my commute to under 1.5 hours daily.
I would get a raise from 18.2% to 39.7% with a possible 15% bonus. My calculation always looks at worse case scenario, but even with 18.2%, I could save an additional 5% on fuel, insurance & commute time rounding it out to +20%.
The job would be in a new industry, health-care, and that in itself scares me because of what may or may not happen in the future of this great nation.
(My skills are horizontal, so they are portable from industry to industry.)
The company looks stable, and seems to have sufficient backing to remain afloat, but there is always that worry.
The loose hours, and working from home most likely will not be an option.
Education benefits may not be there.
And, as a new employee there is always the closeness of the "axe" when cuts need to be made.
So, what would you do? Would you apply for the new job? Would you remain where you are?
I am a single parent, therefore I will not be unemployed. i.e. I am risk averse when it comes to income stability.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/2/2010 11:54:23 PM
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APZR
Posts: 1002
Joined: 4/18/2005
From: GA
Status: offline
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New job offer sounds like a grand gift to get out of bad situation where the ax WILL be falling soon. When a business or department is not preforming well, it's not uncommon to use the "new management" to be an ax man for an incoming CEO. Great raises, less driving, health care industry (which is not going down with more Boomers aging), more time at home with the kids. So even if they don't help pay for education, you can more than make that up with the raises and lower commuting expenses.
_____________________________
Ya can't keep trouble from visitin, but you don't have to offer it a chair.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 12:15:57 AM
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GroupW
Posts: 2849
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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Biggest thing I noticed is that you are a single parent. You've got to weigh the time demands pretty carefully. Will you have the same kind of flexibility you have now ?
Also, what's the direction you would like to take your career? How is this different?
Could this be an opportunity to make a personal style change? Be less outspoken? Make fewer enemies?
Sorry- more questions than answers.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 9:14:13 AM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 1948
Status: offline
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Appreciate the comments.
APZR, The ax can fall, you are absolutely right, but if I painted it to be dire, I need to correct myself. The "weather" in my position is more stable than most others. As I said, the current role I work in is highly needed and I have proven my worth. I also have gone through 5 management changes already, and I always survived. But, as you said it is a possibility.
quote:
Biggest thing I noticed is that you are a single parent. You've got to weigh the time demands pretty carefully. Will you have the same kind of flexibility you have now ?
Thanks for the questions, GroupW. Very unlikely. The flexibility in my schedule is the result of the constant management changes and my willingness to do the job even under duress of time constraints. At best, it would take a few years to prove that I am capable of working no matter where I am located.
quote:
Also, what's the direction you would like to take your career? How is this different?
The new position would be a step back. Not necessarily in compensation and accolade opportunities, but more on the actual work. The new position is mostly management and paper pushing, the current job is "research". I have held the new offer title and position before with success.
quote:
Could this be an opportunity to make a personal style change? Be less outspoken? Make fewer enemies?
Possibly, but not necessarily. The "enemies" I have made are those who disagree with my core principals. Unfortunately no matter where, there will be those who dislike them.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 11:48:56 AM
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thebaker
Posts: 455
Joined: 11/25/2009
Status: offline
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i would say take the new job. constant managment changes...there's a reason for that. either their getting fired or they're resigning. i don't know about you, but i need stable managment to work under. having to get used to new supervisor on a regular basis would be too much for me. not to mention, i think there should be stable management for the sake of the company. plus the commute will be less and i'm not one for having to commute forever just to get to/from work.
now, if the commute doesn't really bother you and if the management changes don't bother you and you are 100% sure your position is safe, i would say stay mainly for the fringe benefits...come in late, leave early, educational benefits, work at home. i had a job with simlar benefits thanks to a flexible supervisor. the amount of quality work he could get out of us case managers was amazing. being able to work from home when you're a little sick OR if there is a water leak that needs to be fixed and you have to be home for the repair person was a blessing.
but most importantly, regardless of what any of us say, you gotta get God's decision on this. does He want you to stay or take the new job? you don't want to be outside of His will.
_____________________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind."
-Dr. Seuss
"Map out your future, but do it in pencil."
-Jon Bon Jovi
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 12:18:57 PM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 1948
Status: offline
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I do have a chart, Elena1030! It is color coded, and includes a mere 120 line items. I am working on dynamically linking it to stock market and the news specific to the industry and the VCs involved with the companies.
quote:
Which offers you more potential for growth in skills and experience? Which kind of work do you enjoy more?
The current position is right now growing with leaps and bounds. An other department discovered that they can save huge by using my expertise, instead of going outside. The new offer is the top for my expertise. Above that, is simply more generic positions, and then the Board. I would also enjoy the current position, if and only if the momentum continues.
thebaker, I think the lack of consistency in management actually helped me to be more independent. Down the road, I may be able to go and start my own business because of this.
I use the commute to listen to a few hours of sermons and music. It is not a bad drive, but it is costly. thebaker, I do not know if He wants me to take the job. I am quite prayerful about it, and have asked my friends to be too. Unfortunately I do not have an ephod and a Levi to ask directly. I am quite disappointed with that, by the way!
I think I am starting to lean to a specific direction. Some of the questions reminded me of some priorities . . . but would love to hear more insights.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 12:57:28 PM
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GroupW
Posts: 2849
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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So it basically comes down to more money, less commute time/expense and a little less challenge and flexibility.
Bit of a tough choice. I've done the long commute (used to do 3.5 hrs a day on a train) and it REALLY wears on you, so I get that. Money is nice. It doesn't buy happiness, but it can make some of the unhappiness a bit more comfortable.
I've had to take a step (or two) backwards in my most recent job, and it's pretty hard to take. That said, I've always been willing to take a step backwards as long as financially it was worth it and I was going to broaden my range of future possible opportunities. If it didn't satisfy both of those criteria, I never considered it. The one time I did, it turned out remarkably well.
The one time I actually did this, I took a step back in management level, but kept my salary roughly the same (but moved to a lower cost city). Financially, it was worth it. As far as new skills and opportunities, it led to some really good times. I wouldn't have done it if both of those things didn't look promising.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 2:27:05 PM
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davelinde
Posts: 1010
Joined: 5/5/2006
From: New Jersey
Status: offline
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quote:
ORIGINAL: jhuperetes
...I am not whining.
...am very grateful
...In my industry that's a nice stretch.
...My current boss would throw me under the bus if it made him look good for 2 seconds. He is also extremely lazy and inept.
...(my boss's boss) is new
...work from home twice a week,
...hours are very relaxed. Come late, leave early. Of course, I am on call 24/7, so I consider that a trade-off.
...no one is indispensable in todays economy.
I've been with my employer 25 years and can retire next year
I telecommute 5 day/week now - beyond that a lot of very similar factors -see the list I clipped above as matching! I thought for sure I'd retire next year and find something new to do. Since my pension program was frozen I will not be working for anything extra once I qualify, though the pension won't be enough to live on... and would need some kind of supplementing. But -- for similar reasons to your thinking, I'm now thinking there's no chance I can replace the flexibility I somehow stumbled into.
Best wishes with your decision. I'm still pondering mine.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/3/2010 8:34:46 PM
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GroupW
Posts: 2849
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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One other question-
If your current boss isn't effective, and he has a new boss, any chance your existing boss moves on and leaves you an opportunity to do something different/better? I've had that happen. Doesn't mean you necessarily get his spot, but duties often get shuffled around to make best use of the resources at hand - particularly when times are tight.
Just a thought.
BT
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/5/2010 5:12:32 PM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 1948
Status: offline
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Thanks for all the insight.
I have turned the offer down.
Two primary reasons - flexible time which helps with children, and core career direction.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/6/2010 12:19:03 PM
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stimulus
Posts: 89
Joined: 6/4/2005
Status: offline
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If it's not too late, I think you should at least try negotiating for what you want. If you want to stay at your current job, ask for higher pay or an additional telecommute day. You've said your skills are needed, rare, and saving the company money. Tell them you've been approached about another job that is appealing, but you want to stay, adn see if they wil offer anything.
On the other hand, if you want to move to the other company, you could have asked about flexible work hours. You could have explained that you're a single parent, and you've proven to your current employer that you can work from home effectively. Ask if that would be a possibility as part of a flexible work schedule.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/6/2010 1:58:12 PM
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jhuperetes
Posts: 1948
Status: offline
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Stimulus, thanks for the idea.
I shy away from pitting one job against an other.
From my experience watching others do it, it always ended with either the negotiation was rejected, in which case the employee had to depart, or the employer succumbs to the demands because they are in a bind, but immediately go into a "replacement" mode. This eventually results in the employee 'laid off' or replaced.
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RE: Is it a sweet job offer or a nightmare of unemploym... - 2/8/2010 1:30:27 PM
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GroupW
Posts: 2849
Joined: 11/16/2007
From: Up in the hills of Colorado (very BIG hills...)
Status: offline
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I agree with that - if you are going to try to use the offer to improve your current status with your employer, you have to be prepared to leave and take the other offer.
That said, you can use the other offer as a data point when your review comes up and use it to justify a salary proposal. You still have to do that very judiciously - that can mean that you phrase it in terms of "this is what is out there" and not "this is what I was offered"
Often you don't want to be perceived as actively looking. In some industries, actively looking or being perceived as such is more tolerated than in others.
_____________________________
“For every problem, there is a solution that is simple, elegant and wrong.” -H.L. Mencken
"Most people would rather die than think; in fact, they do so." -Bertrand Russell
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